There have been waves of reform in the past. I see no reason why they wouldn't happen again. Jane Mayer More Quotes by Jane Mayer More Quotes From Jane Mayer [The Kochs] they hate big government. Jane Mayer bigs government hate Donald Trump actually is a pretty big-government conservative. He doesn't see eye-to-eye with them [the Kochs] on trade. Jane Mayer conservative government eye They [the Kochs] want free trade and cheap labour. They own the second-largest private company in America, which is a huge multinational corporation. So they are on a different wavelength. Jane Mayer wavelength different america One of the oddities of this election is the man that [Donald] Trump chose as his vice-president, Mike Pence, is one of the Kochs' favourite politicians. Jane Mayer oddities president men In fact, Charles Koch tried to get [Mike] Pence to run for the White House in 2012. Jane Mayer white house running There are some areas where the Kochs are on the same page with [Donald] Trump. He doesn't believe in global warming. He says it's a hoax . Jane Mayer hoaxes pages believe [Donald] Trump has put forward a list of people he would like to see on the Supreme Court, whom the Kochs would be very happy with too. So it's not all bad for them. Jane Mayer lists would-be people There's not as much big money on the left, but you've got George Soros, who has the Open Society Institute. He's pushing liberal policies. Jane Mayer policy pushing bigs [Tom] Steyer is specifically spending money on candidates who will take action against climate change. Jane Mayer spending climate action There's a difference between those two [George Soroses and the Tom Steyers] and the Kochs that I think is important. Jane Mayer differences two thinking The book that I wrote is called Dark Money, and it's about secret spending that is very hard to follow. [George] Soros's whole thing is about government transparency, so he spends very much in the open, and the same with [Tom] Steyer. Jane Mayer government dark book We would see another president being accused of being illegitimate, and undermined from day one, which is exactly what these donors did to [Barack] Obama. Jane Mayer being-accused donors president And I think that what is of concern is that they seem to be bringing skills from the scientific world into the interrogation room in a way that begs a lot of questions about whether it's ethical. Jane Mayer questions think way world And the program was developed in large part by behavioral scientists who were working with the military, who do everything they possibly can to measure a soldier's stress levels to see how they're doing physically and emotionally, as they go through this program. Jane Mayer doing see stress soldier And, in fact, there is a connection, the people who designed this here program and who implement it are the same people who are overseeing and helping in the interrogations of detainees in places like Guantanamo. Jane Mayer connection places like people Now that he has disavowed as outright lies many of the stories he told himself, it's hard to know what to make of those who still insist that David Brock had it right the first time. Jane Mayer know hard first-time time So, it, of course, makes one wonder how many other people there might be who are completely innocent, who have been sent by the U.S. to countries where they've been interrogated, and in some instances it seems tortured. Jane Mayer some innocent wonder people